Subject: Re: Ayn Rand's Statist, Randroid Idiots: Out of the mouths of 'Objectivists' Mon May 25, 2020 2:31 am
But, suppose I come from Mars. Government never took money from me or my parents. According to these Randians, I would not be justified in taking government funds.
Location : Wasted Space Job/hobbies : Cayman Islands Actuary
Subject: Re: Ayn Rand's Statist, Randroid Idiots: Out of the mouths of 'Objectivists' Tue Jun 30, 2020 6:11 pm
Intellectual pygmy Yaron Brook takes another stab at AnCappers:
"I think anarchy leads to nothing but bloodshed and destruction and ultimately it leads inevitably to authoritarianism.
"If you're an anarchist in your 40's, something's wrong.
"If you're over 40 and an anarchist, I'm not sitting on stage with you... you're a bad person.
"Anarchy is a destructive ideology. I'm willing to tolerate it when you're young.... at some point my tolerance disappears, and I'm not tolerant of anti-life ideas from people who should know better.
"Anarcho-Capitalism is not a legitimate ideology. It's not worthy of debate.
Location : Wasted Space Job/hobbies : Cayman Islands Actuary
Subject: Re: Ayn Rand's Statist, Randroid Idiots: Out of the mouths of 'Objectivists' Mon Oct 05, 2020 9:54 pm
Deluded utopian objectivist Robin Craig's non-answer...
Is the law one of mankind's greatest achievements?
I would say yes, the law is one of mankind’s greatest achievements.
But let us [re]define our terms: I mean the law in the sense of objectively defined and applied laws, where a crime is defined in easily understood terms and everyone is subject to the law, so it is government “by laws not men”. [And which is, as you note below, not yet an achievement!]
Certainly not the greatest achievement: that is the development of rational philosophy, from which the idea of objective law derives. But for people to live together in productive harmony, we need a government built on objective laws, so that our rights (to life, liberty, property and the pursuit of happiness) are defended, both objectively (not subject to individual whim, even our own), effectively (the government needs to be more powerful than the criminals) and justly (which is a subset of objectively, as good laws must be based on justice).
It is interesting that the ancient Greeks illustrated this in a series of myths where someone did something bad to someone else, and for generations after, each new generation had their revenge on the other lineage; with this cycle finally broken by a system of law, not vendetta.
To see the benefit of such laws, consider how difficult life would be if you were prey to every random thug or gang, with no recourse but your own abilities; or worse [why is it worse?], the grandchild of someone your grandfather harmed turns up to ruin your life, feeling perfectly justified in doing so!
That said, like all inventions from sharpened rocks onward, the law can be misused. The law can be turned to maintaining the power of a dictator or ruling class; it can be turned to punishing behaviour which hurts nobody else but is deemed immoral (think homosexuality and the “war” on drugs). But even in its modern, imperfect form, it is a big step up from what went on before.
And one day, perhaps the law will finally be purified to where its sole purpose is the protection of individual rights.
... When the Letter was a List the website contained the following “HBL Loyalty Oath” which members implicitly took, sort of like a software shrink-wrap agreement:
I “exclude anyone who is sanctioning or supporting the enemies of Ayn Rand and Objectivism. ‘Enemies’ include: ‘libertarians’ [he doesn’t define the term], moral agnostics or ‘tolerationists’, anarchists, and those whom Ayn Rand condemned morally or who have written books or articles attacking Ayn Rand. I do not wish to publicize the myriad of anti-Objectivist individuals and organizations by giving names ... .
“If you bristle at the very idea of a ‘loyalty oath’ and declaring certain ideological movements and individuals as ‘enemies’, then my list is probably not for you. To join my list while concealing your sanction or support of these enemies, would be to commit a fraud.”
Restricting an Objectivist study list to people sincerely interested in studying Objectivism is reasonable, though calling this a “loyalty oath” was kind of silly – “expressing sincere interest” would have served the purpose and not sounded like a Masonic Lodge initiation. But whatever you call it, considering his own writings sincere interest in Objectivism is not what he seeks.
The Loyalty Oath disappeared when the List became a Letter, replaced with a shorter and more urbane statement amounting to the same thing but without the silly title.
Subject: Re: Ayn Rand's Statist, Randroid Idiots: Out of the mouths of 'Objectivists' 
Sun Feb 09, 2020 3:58 am
